2022-02-03 Product Council Meeting notes
Date
Attendees
- Aaron Trehub, Alexis Manheim, Ann-Marie Breaux (Deactivated), Anya, Brooks Travis, Charlotte Whitt, Christopher Spalding, Felix Hemme, Gang Zhou, Gar Sydnor Hkaplanian, Ian Walls, Jana Freytag, Jesse Koennecke, Karen Newbery, Khalilah Gambrell, Kristin Martin, Martina Schildt, Martina Tumulla, Maura Byrne, Mikhail Fokanov, Owen Stephens, Paul Moeller, Peter Murray, Raegan Wiechert, Sharon Wiles-Young, twliu, Tod Olson, VBar
Discussion items
| Time | Item | Who | Notes |
|---|---|---|---|
| 5 min | Announcements | Lotus code release deadline is pushed back a few weeks: Lotus (R1 2022)
National Science Library in Namibia went live on FOLIO last week. | |
| 45 mins | Authority Control
Discussion goals:
| Khalilah Gambrell (presenter/demo) Mikhail Fokanov (presenter/demo) | Clarifying that no MARC authority data is being stored; a more generic schema is being used (authority.json) and stored in mod-inventory-storage. When the development team gathers for building the Entities app, this schema could be used as a start. This follows the pattern of mod-inventory-storage and mod-search for instance/holdings records. The intention is not to constrain what the Entities app developers might do, and might point to future work to simplify the functionality now being done in the Inventory app. For Lotus: just authority storage and management; work on "control" is expected to start in Morning Glory. In the course of creating the MARC Authority app, there have been improvements made to the Stripes table view component to make it more accessible to screen readers. John Colburn has been making these updates and working with Zak to get them integrated into other apps as well. Data Import is used to add authority records to the system; there is not a "New" action. This is in line with feedback from the QuickMARC testing libraries. This MARC Authority app needs approval from PC for inclusion in the Lotus release. There are concerns about the process by which a new app was developed and how late in the development process that PC learned about it. For instance, we would want coordination between the group that conceived of the Entities app and this development of the MARC Authorities app. The MM SIG could have been learned about the development of the authority schema and the use of mod-inventory-storage earlier. The PC is interested in reviewing functionality as it is being conceived because it doesn't want to ask TC to perform unnecessary technical reviews. Can the SIG updates be used to raise awareness of this kind of upcoming functionality? Does PC endorse this app being added to FOLIO? No objections from PC members. PC asks TC to perform a technical review of the MARC Authorities app. Taking a step or two back, should the PC be in a position to not accept something that an organization has devoted effort and money into building? |
| 15 min | Community recruitment: discussion of how to recruit more POs and/or developers | Getting Started for Product Owners has information about product owners. Lucy: There are companies in China that want to join the development effort; can videos and resources be created to help assist that? Can the videos that are on Google Drive now be updated to current? The WOLFcon Asia Pacific Conference is tentatively scheduled April 23, and that would be a good time to share this information and recruit developers. | |
| 5 min | future topics: | Functional criteria for FOLIO Next week is the SIG update meeting, the template for reports from SIG conveners is here: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1268qg6EoxMwgqnmQkgeUycZkZJQs-No4rJr5xizvamw/edit# |
Chat log
09:33:50 From Khalilah Gambrell to Everyone:
Lotus Release timeline: Lotus (R1 2022)
Feb 11th: Platform core dev freeze
Feb 18th: Platform complete dev freeze
March 14th - March 25th: Bugfest
April 18th: Go Live
09:34:11 From Brooks Travis to Everyone:
Overall schedule for Lotus has been pushed by a sprint, no change to MG planned, is my understanding
09:34:49 From Khalilah Gambrell to Everyone:
Morning Glory timeline: Morning Glory (R2 2022)
June 3rd: Platform core dev freeze
June 10: Platform complete dev freeze
June 24: Module release deadline
July 4 -15: Bugfest
August 8th: Public Release
09:35:41 From Khalilah Gambrell to Everyone:
Lotus timeline: https://folio-org.atlassian.net/wiki/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=5210536
09:35:57 From Khalilah Gambrell to Everyone:
Morning Glory timeline: https://folio-org.atlassian.net/wiki/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=5210570
09:42:19 From Brooks Travis to Everyone:
Using ElasticSearch
09:42:52 From Brooks Travis to Everyone:
It's a JSON authority representation
09:42:57 From Ian Walls to Everyone:
so, the practical upshot is that we can make use of Authority records without having to depend on MARC at all
09:42:59 From Felix Hemme (ZBW) to Everyone:
https://github.com/folio-org/mod-inventory-storage/blob/master/ramls/authorities/authority.json
09:45:02 From Harry to Everyone:
+1 Ian
09:45:36 From Peter Murray to Everyone:
Fascinating decision!
09:45:41 From Ian Walls to Everyone:
+10 to Spitfire for building it this way
09:47:01 From Ian Walls to Everyone:
The Future of Libraries is MARC-less!
09:49:55 From Brooks Travis to Everyone:
Data import integration and ES
09:51:35 From Charlotte Whitt to Everyone:
Eventually we hope also to use Elasticsearch in Users and many more apps, but that do not mean that we will store Users in mod-inventory-storage?
09:53:50 From Ian Walls to Everyone:
from a SysOps perspective, it's great not to have yet another module to install and connect.
09:55:26 From Aaron Trehub to Everyone:
Have to leave for another meeting...
09:57:31 From Charlotte Whitt to Everyone:
Entity Management Vision written by the working group lead by Jason Kovari (Cornell): https://folio-org.atlassian.net/wiki/display/MM/Entities+App%3A+Vision
09:58:15 From Charlotte Whitt to Everyone:
Sounds good, Vince
09:58:55 From Owen Stephens to Everyone:
It might be an interesting thing to do to compare that vision to what is delivered by this work - as I think the work there was focussed on authority, even though as a vision it wanted to consider broader impact of entity management
10:00:31 From Brooks Travis to Everyone:
No control
10:00:50 From Brooks Travis to Everyone:
Just storage and management
10:02:22 From Owen Stephens to Everyone:
I’m afraid I have to leave the meeting for a bit - I’ll catch up with the demo later thanks Khalilah
10:08:39 From Felix Hemme (ZBW) to Everyone:
Thanks Harry for the clarification
10:08:41 From Peter Murray to Everyone:
Reflecting on what you said earlier, I note there is no "New" action in the MARC Authority App.
10:14:20 From Brooks Travis to Everyone:
Is MARC Authority app only searching records of source=MARC?
10:14:30 From Brooks Travis to Everyone:
At present
10:15:17 From Peter Murray to Everyone:
In the JSON schema, there is a field that indicates whether it is "MARC" or "FOLIO". I think you said we don't have the notion of a "FOLIO" authority record at the moment, so there isn't a record being stored as that native JSON schema, right?
10:15:53 From Brooks Travis to Everyone:
There's an API for that, isn't there
10:16:00 From Brooks Travis to Everyone:
?
10:16:26 From Ian Walls to Everyone:
we do have a FOLIO Authority record schema, which is what is searched and all, but there is no front-end for editing that record directly.
10:16:35 From Felix Hemme (ZBW) to Everyone:
Yes, you can POST to this storage according to https://s3.amazonaws.com/foliodocs/api/mod-inventory-storage/authorities.html#
10:16:55 From Peter Murray to Everyone:
Ah, fascinating...thanks, Ian and Felix.
10:17:57 From Ian Walls to Everyone:
I look forward to editing FOLIO-native records at some point in the future, but it doesn't sound like that was the driving factor for this development
10:18:30 From Peter Murray to Everyone:
Yes, that makes sense.
10:19:24 From Peter Murray to Everyone:
I wonder about that, too...just calling the app "Authority".
10:19:39 From Peter Murray to Everyone:
That would better set the expectations for what is to come.
10:22:22 From Brooks Travis to Everyone:
To me, I think the current naming makes more sense. This was built MARC-first, and it could, frankly, be MARC-only while we wait on the entity management WG that could result in a wholly new UI/set of UI apps that could potentially replace it.
10:23:24 From Peter Murray to Everyone:
So maybe the "MARC Authorities" app would go away when the "Entities" app overtakes it?
10:23:31 From Brooks Travis to Everyone:
I, for one, think that this is great work.
10:23:47 From Tod Olson to Everyone:
++Brooks
10:25:30 From Ian Walls to Everyone:
Falcon +10
10:25:56 From Tod Olson to Everyone:
Thank you KG for the demo and discussion. This is really interesting. Nice way to build toward a non-MARC-centric future.
10:29:54 From Brooks Travis to Everyone:
I also feel like I heard about this for months in various fora. It was included in the roadmap back in November.
10:31:03 From Brooks Travis to Everyone:
Isn't that outside the scope of the SIGs, though? The technical implementation?
10:31:43 From Peter Murray to Everyone:
In an app-based model, we also need to expect flexibility in how ideas for apps come about.
10:32:11 From Ian Walls to Everyone:
Peter++
10:32:12 From Brooks Travis to Everyone:
I would move to approve this for inclusion. It's functionality that has been requested and highly-ranked by existing and potential adopters. It significantly enhances market fit and has high strategic impact for the project.
10:32:23 From Ann-Marie Breaux to Everyone:
the quickMARC, Data Import, and Entity Management groups are all subgroups of MM SIG
10:32:36 From Brooks Travis to Everyone:
++Ann-Marie
10:33:21 From Peter Murray to Everyone:
Owen++ "we can move as an agile community"
10:34:16 From Ian Walls to Everyone:
I would argue that we don't need permission to move forward with particular developments, so much as consent as to whether to include it in the standard community build
10:35:57 From Owen Stephens to Everyone:
I agree with that Ian - but this is my point about the existing modules. They are already part of the community build and there’s no process or option (as it stands) to do something different to that
10:39:39 From Owen Stephens to Everyone:
That makes sense to me Ian - I definitely think being clear about how this works (whether it’s this model or something else) is the right way to go
10:40:24 From Ian Walls to Everyone:
and I would agree that there needs to be a mechanism for making sure an already-accepted set of code is continuing to meet the articulated needs.
10:40:57 From Ian Walls to Everyone:
this could cover both new areas of functionality as well as the necessities of maintenance
10:42:19 From Owen Stephens to Everyone:
That’s a huge statement to finish on!
10:42:58 From Karen Newbery to Everyone:
But Harry, didn't you argue against that very statement regarding the LDP?
10:44:07 From Kristin Martin to Everyone:
That has been part of the discussion of the Scope-Criteria group.
10:44:08 From Harry to Everyone:
Karen, I did not..
10:44:21 From Felix Hemme (ZBW) to Everyone:
Thank you Khalilah. Bye
10:44:59 From Harry to Everyone:
There is no question that LDP is critical to many libraries.
10:45:41 From Harry to Everyone:
The question is why is PC even making judgement calls as to what is important or what isn’t.
10:46:19 From Harry to Everyone:
And taking that into account with our current and unscalable release process implies that we need a major change.
10:46:52 From Ian Walls to Everyone:
Harry and Kristin, I would love to continue this conversation in Slack. would y'all be willing to pick this up in #folio-product-council?
10:47:29 From Ian Walls to Everyone:
sorry, not just Kristin, also Karen (tracing chat backlog). also, everyone interested
10:49:37 From Harry to Everyone:
I think so, if I have time.
10:51:12 From Ian Walls to Everyone:
of course. I just think this is a very important topic for the community to talk about as we move forward
10:52:03 From Kristin Martin to Everyone:
A small group of us is considering this topic and I think we'll be ready for a fuller discussion with PC shortly. I don't see this as the end!
10:52:37 From Harry to Everyone:
+100 Kristin & Ian!
10:53:13 From Karen Newbery to Everyone:
Thanks, Kristin!
10:55:04 From Peter Murray to Everyone:
SIG convener update document> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1268qg6EoxMwgqnmQkgeUycZkZJQs-No4rJr5xizvamw/edit#
10:55:50 From Brooks Travis to Everyone:
Thanks, everyone!
10:55:53 From Karen Newbery to Everyone:
Stay safe and warm!